▷S2E2 Texas Wine with Shelly Wilfong

English

Oct 10

Shelly Wilfong, host of the podcast This is Texas Wine, takes Rose Thomas through the map of the USA's fifth-largest wine producing state. Rose Thomas likes Shelly's podcast so much, she scheduled a trip to Texas to learn more. Texas is larger than France, with diverse terroirs, beautiful tasting rooms, talented winemakers and the occasional prize saddle.

Check out Shelly's podcast and her excellent website full of resources for the Texas-Wine-curious: https://www.thisistexaswine.com/

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one of the biggest wine competitions in America actually is associated with a Houston livestock show and rodeo. And if you win, you get a saddle, a horse saddle. If you win pop winery, you get an actual saddle. And there's a winery in the health country you may want to stop by. They have I think four or five saddles displayed in their tasting room. But if you win kind of a class championship, so your wine is the best, you know, San Jose, say $25 to $40, you get a belt buckle. So people collect, I mean, they have a million belt buckles. And if you're lucky, maybe even a saddle. Wow. I love that. That is some local culture people. That is wonderful. Welcome to Welcome to Modo di Bere, the podcast about local drinks and local sayings. I'm your host, Rose Thomas Bannister. I'm here today with Shelly Wilfong, a wine educator and the host of the excellent podcast, "This Is Texas Wine." Shelly, welcome. - Thank you so much. I'm delighted to be here. - Shelly reminds me of an old fashioned newspaper reporter. She delivers the latest news on Texas Wine along with truly interesting interviews. But my favorite part of your show is at the end, which is the gold stars and demerits. Shelly's website feels like a one -step resource on Texas wine. I really feel your love for wine, for Texas, and for the wines of Texas. Well, thank you. That's the idea. It's definitely a labor of love, but I've had a lot of fun doing it, and I'm glad you like the demerits and gold stars. It's fun to see how those have evolved, and now people send me their ideas for demerits and gold stars that I should include. That is hilarious. What's your favorite demerit and gold star that immediately comes to mind? Well, I can tell you the most recent one. I just dropped a podcast today, number 69. And the gold star is that one of the top restaurants in the entire nation was just named the 2023 Food and Wine Magazine top restaurant of the year. It's called Birdies in Austin, Texas. So that's a gold star. They have a 250 bottle wine list. Unfortunately, only two of those bottles are from Texas. And so that is the demerit. So I try not to be totally scathing in the demerits, but I do have to kind of poke at things when I see decisions that aren't really Texas wine friendly. Well, I enjoy it. It's like you're, you're spilling the wine, it's a little guilty pleasure. I enjoy it. So I would love to know when did you fall in love with Texas Wine and what inspired you to start this podcast? - Well, I have been writing about Texas Wine for about six years, primarily for a website called Texas Wine Lover. And through that site, I had the opportunity to meet with a lot of producers, try a lot of Texas wines. I had been studying wines for many years prior to that, but in the different programs like the WSET programs and so forth, you just don't learn about Texas. Maybe you have a vague idea that Texas makes some wine just because all the other states do too, but there wasn't any kind of focused attention on Texas. But about six years ago, I had the opportunity to start writing for this Texas -focused wine website. And at the time, I mean, I had had some Texas wine that I thought was fine, but I hadn't explored very widely. And so through writing, I really came to know more about Texas wine. And since then, there are some Texas -specific wine certifications that you can get. Anybody can. You don't have to be a Texas resident. And so I've also pursued those. But early on, there was not a lot of Texas wine in my general wine education. But during the pandemic, actually, I was thinking about how I wanted to pursue more around Texas wine. And I thought there is not currently a Texas wine podcast. There had been one many years in the past that had produced maybe 20 or so episodes, I believe. And then that had gone away. And so I thought, well, how hard could it very famous last words. It's not terribly hard, but there is a lot that goes into it, as you know. And I've had a great time and really focusing. It's a very large state. It's actually even bigger than France. And so there's plenty of material. Let's just say that. I love earning certifications. Tell me about the Texas Wine Certification. There are two Texas Wine Certifications that are both offered by the same instructor in the same school, which is called the Texas Wine School. They do classes both in person and virtually and the Texas Wine Certification is a level one and then an advanced level, level two. And those are both held virtually. So anywhere you can receive a shipment of wine, you could order the wines for the class and take the class. It's taught by Dr. Russ Kane, who is just a brilliant historian and he has really chronicled so much of the Texas wine story and has taught me a good amount of what I know. I've forgotten more than I should have at this point, but it's been a fun journey to really delve into everything Texas. Now, I'm about to delve into Texas myself because at the moment in time when this interview is being recorded, I'm about a week out from having a Texas wine adventure. So I'm really excited about that and grateful to you and your podcast. You have these wonderful maps along with other resources on your website. Could you kind of take us through the wine regions in the map? Surely. Like I said, it's a very big state and Texas actually is the number five wine producing state in the nation And there are several key wine -growing areas in the state. There are actually eight aviaries, but I'll tell you about a few of the most important. One is called the Texas High Plains. And if you're looking at a map of Texas, look at the top left -hand corner. So the northwestern part of the state, and Texas High Plains, the main city nearby is Lubbock, Texas, which is a college town. And that is an agricultural focused area, not only for wine grapes, but for many, many crops that are grown in Texas, everything from cotton to soybeans to peanuts to watermelon. And back in the 70s, a bunch of grow farmers actually started growing grapes because it was a more water friendly crop, there was more value per acre, etc. And so that's actually the primary growing region in the state of Texas. And about 80 % of the grapes grown in Texas are in that AVA, the Texas High Plains. The other area that you should really focus in on is actually where I believe you are going on your upcoming trip, and that is the Texas Hill Country. And the Texas Hill Country is just right in the smack dab middle of Texas. And it is the third largest AVA or American Viticultural Area in the country. So it is a huge, huge region. There are some subregions, some nested AVA's within that and there are about to be even a couple more. But that middle part of Texas is where most of the tourism is based. So many, many wineries using grapes from the high plains will bring them into their wineries that are located in the Hill Country. And when you hear about Texas wine tourism, most likely you're focusing in on the area in the Hill Country. So towns, cities like Austin and San Antonio are very close and even Houston and Dallas are within maybe a four hour trip into the Hill Country. So there's a lot of population, a lot of tourism and it's an exciting area, not just for tourism, but there are actually also vineyards there. That's the second most prolific area for wine grape growing in the state. Another thing to know about the first area I mentioned, the Texas High Plains, you might have guessed from the title of the region, it is at high elevation. Now, it's as flat as a pancake, but it is at very high elevation. I mean, not just for Texas, but for anywhere in the world. When we're talking about high elevation viticulture, this area absolutely counts because the vineyards are somewhere around up to 4 ,000 feet in elevation. I am aware that wine is grown in all 50 states, and some of those states clearly are more famous than others for their wine. And when I started to hear about Texas wine, I assumed there must be an elevation because, you know, the the first thing people think about is that Texas is so hot. Can you talk a little bit about why that high elevation area would be the main AVA, American Viticultural Area in Texas? The high elevation helps because grapes, although they may heat up during the day, there's going to be a large shift in the temperature from day to night, and that allows the grapes to retain a lot of their acidity, which helps just with the general chemistry and winemaking and makes for better grades that extends the growing season a bit. So that is one reason why that is an area that's really important. Now, the Hill Country where you're visiting does not have that altitude and it's also a successful wine grape growing region. So there are a lot of factors that can play in, but elevation certainly does help. But you mentioned that Texas is hot, and it certainly is. But Texas is also surprisingly cold. We've had all kinds of crazy weather events as of late, but even in prior years, some of the main risks to grape growing in Texas are late spring freezes. But we also can have an early freeze in the fall. We actually had one back in 2019 on Halloween. So the grapes had not yet kind of returned to normal after the harvest, and they were really damaged by a big freeze. So we just have high highs and low lows. - Yeah, what about climate change in Texas? How is that affecting the grape growers? - It's definitely affecting the grape growers and they'll be the first to tell you, I think the farmers are always the first to know when something is different than it's always been. One thing that grape growers are doing is planting the right varieties for their particular vineyard. When the Texas wine industry got started in the 70s, they were planting a lot of grapes that did really well in California and international varieties that people were looking for, they wanted their Chardonnay, their Merlot, their Cabernet Sauvignon, et cetera. And sometimes those grapes do well in Texas and other times different grapes would be a better choice. And we can see that in wine regions around the world, like in Bordeaux, where they're now allowing grapes that have never been allowed in Bordeaux. And it's because of the changing climate. So a lot of winery owners and winemakers are looking to the warmer regions in the world to see what's doing well there. There are a number of wineries that are planting grapes from Portugal. Portugal Portugal's also very warm. A lot of grapes from the south of France do quite well in Texas. So you're not seeing quite as many cool climate grapes like the Chardonnay's and the Pinot Noirs, although there are some, but you're more and more commonly now seeing grapes that do well with the warm climate. I'm really interested in biodiversity, both of grapes and also of language. I'm really excited to see that people are experimenting with the wider variety. I think it's really interesting in terms of the climate. And also it's for me as a consumer, I think it's really fun to have so much choice. So what are some of the more unique or interesting grapes that you've been seeing planted in Texas lately? I'll mention a few that have done well here that I'm particularly excited about. On the red side, although Cabernet Sauvignon is our number one most planted grape. A few that are doing really well that I'm excited about are "Tenot" "T -A -N -N -A -T" which is a fun word in and of itself and San Jovese does pretty well here, "Muvadra" so another one from the south of France and they're actually speaking of varieties though you need to understand that Texas has tremendous varietal diversity, something like 80 or more across the state. So while in California, you kind of know, depending on what region you're in, what you might be tasting at a winery in Texas, you just really have no idea. And some wineries have just a tremendous list, even within one winery, of how many different varieties they work with. On the white side, I particularly love albarino and vermentino, although many people came to know Texas wine and what they considered maybe some of our signature grapes are on the red side, Tempranillo, and on the white side, Vianier, and those both do really well in some places, but I wouldn't say that Texas is putting all of its eggs in those particular baskets. Now, I don't want to just give all of the light to the stuff that's already doing well in the market. But if somebody wants to try some Texas wine and they're far away from Texas, maybe but in a city in a place that's lucky enough to have a wide -ranging wine list, what are some of the producers that people might see that get a chance to try? That's a really tricky question because Texans drink most Texas wine because very little of it makes it out of the state. As a producer, you have to really want to get your wines into distribution to have them go beyond the state borders because there's just not enough of it, frankly. There are certain markets where there is a presence for Texas wine. If you see anything by McPherson, McPherson sellers, that is one that you should definitely investigate. One of the two large wineries in Texas have certain distribution. One is called Yano Esticado, the other is called Becker Vineyards, but you might be surprised to just find a Texas wine from a very small producer that just has some particular relationship with a small wine shop in New York or Washington, D .C. So you might find something unexpected there. And if you do, you should try it. Is there a large DTC direct to consumer model for the Texas wineries, meaning that people can just contact the winery and have the wine shipped to them? - Absolutely, direct to consumer is huge and tourism is huge. People sell a lot of wine out of their tasting room. Wine clubs are enormous. Some wineries But then, you know, a small regional winery, say up in North Texas, where I'm located, may have 4 ,000 wine club members. So there's just a lot. When you're considering that most wineries in Texas are small to medium size, more small even than medium, there are really no large Texas wineries in the scope of large wineries in the world. So they're doing a lot of business, DTC, I guess. What are some numbers about Texas wine in general? - Well, if you consider that the top wine states, you know, California obviously outshines them all, but you think Oregon is one of them, right? Texas makes just a fraction of the wine that Oregon makes. So in terms of size, it is quite small, but it is growing. New vineyards are being planted. We have about 9 ,300 acres of grapevines, which is approximately the size of the New York Finger Lakes, just under the size of New York Finger Lakes, if that gives you an idea since you're in New York. But it's still a small industry. It's still, there's a lot of experimentation, a lot of people joining the industry who are moving in from all across the world, frankly, a lot of Texans that went to make wine somewhere else are coming back home to do it here. It's an exciting time, a ton of growth. - What's special about Texas wine? Why should people be looking at this region? - Well, it's not enough, in my opinion, to just be from Texas and to say, "Well, you have to try it from Texas." That's, in wine terms, that's not enough, right? But what's exciting is that Texas wines are winning awards and blind tastings across the world. And I love to see that because sometimes, even within our own state, people have an opinion about Texas wine that maybe they tasted some 20 years ago and they didn't like it and so it must not be good. But that is no longer the case. There is so much technology and expertise behind viticulture and winemaking in the state and then when it goes out of the state or country and wins these huge awards, I love to see it because it just gives some Enforcement to the people that are working so hard doing doing hard jobs. We have a ton of vintage variation here is another thing that you should know about Texas So we've had years that everything is perfectly beautiful and then some years that are more challenging I I say that Texas wine makers are some of the best in the world because you do have to deal With different fruit every year You're not just following a recipe because you're gonna have to be called on to to do do something new, try something new based on how the fruit looks right now we're in an extreme drought. So what does that look like for your winemaking there's just a lot a lot to think through every single year. Well, it seems like there's a lot of innovation going on. I love listening to some of the people on your podcast. What are some of your favorite interviews that you've done? Well, not all of my interviews are actually with producers, some are with, you know, vineyard managers or different people, but I can tell you a few that that I think I recommended that you might wanna check out when you're in the whole country. One of them is Adega Vino, and it's owned by a family and some brothers that manage everything, including an estate vineyard. And one of the cool things that they're doing is planting a lot of varieties that I mentioned from Portugal. So things that you may or may not have ever had the opportunity to taste anywhere in the world, Texas or Rento, who would have thunk, but they are also starting to incorporate some biodynamic principles, which I know is a particular interest of yours. And so that's one to watch. I felt like when I was recording it that it was really getting detailed about the farming and I thought maybe this is too much, but I got more positive feedback about that interview than many that I've done. I also really like talking to people who have had a part in the development of the Texas wine industry and one interview that I just recorded last week that I haven't yet, I haven't dropped yet. It's on the on the way in a few weeks is with the founders, the co -founders of Messina Hoff Winery and it's a husband and wife. And when they were first married, they decided to plant a vineyard and that was in the 70s. And all along the way, they've held leadership positions in the state organizations that try to support wine growers and grape growers. And they've just done a tremendous job. And so I love sitting down with folks that have that kind of history and just asking them a bunch of questions. So I'm excited for the future and what's to come. But I have a special place in my heart for the people that have gotten us this far. I think I found it just as I was looking for some general new wine podcast to listen to. And it really did sway me to come and visit Texas just because you seem to be having so much fun. Well, yes, I'm so glad you're coming. I just want to take a moment now at the midpoint of this interview to thank my Patreon subscribers. Alan, thank you so much for being such a big supporter of the show. I hope you're having an amazing time on that adventure in Taiwan. I want to give all my listeners a heads up that later this month there will be a really fun bonus episode of the MotoDBerry podcast that will be available only to Patreon subscribers. In order to sustain this podcast, I do need to cover costs like equipment, web hosting, software subscriptions, and other expenses. For instance, Next month I'm purchasing some new microphones for video interviews. If you've enjoyed the show and you've benefited from the local culture stories, interviews, and advice that I share on Motodibere, I encourage you to become a Patreon subscriber today to unlock that exclusive bonus content at the $5 level. It's easy to sign up at patreon .com /motodibere. You can even take a moment to head over there now. Shelly and I will be here when you get back ready to share some practical advice for Texas wine travel. If somebody like me is planning a trip to come and taste Texas wine, visit your tasting rooms, visit your vineyards, I wonder what advice you would have for us. For one thing, I think you're going to be impressed by the level of hospitality. That is one thing that Texas does so well is to welcome you into these wineries. You may well be sitting across the table from the owner, from the winemaker. A lot of them are quite small. So you do need to have a plan. You may need to have some reservations. That's kind of new after the COVID era. A lot of places did require reservations and that has continued, which I think actually gives you a better experience. So I would try to keep an open mind to what you might be tasting. You may have varieties that you're not overly familiar with you may have some blends that you would have never thought to put together But you know, this is the new world, baby We can do whatever we want and that's kind of the attitude of a lot of a lot of folks I would plan ahead for driving the wider ease There are a number of them very close together between the towns of Fredericksburg and Johnson City and then In that general vicinity, but you don't want to drive yourself. So make a plan to have somebody drive you and just enjoy, enjoy and be open -minded about the experience. I think you'll have some great wines. I will say that most wineries will have a sweet option, but not all of them do, but most of what you're gonna taste is dry. You can expect red, white, rosé, dessert, and sparkling all the above. And I just think that you'll have a lot of fun with it. I can't wait to get your impressions. And I hope that you'll come on my show and tell me what you think about your experience in Texas and the wines. - I will love that. Let's definitely set that up when I get back from this trip. I would love to let you know what I find out. Well, as you know, Shelly, from listening to my show, I have become an unexpected fan of adventurous driving. So being that I am gonna rent a car and drive around. Do you have any Texas driving advice? There are a lot of trucks on the road. Big cars is possibly a good thing, so you won't be too outmatched. And there's a lot of construction because, like I said, the growth in the area is insane. So there's a lot going on down in the Hill Country. But you will eat well and you will drink well and see some beautiful sights. I'm glad the weather is finally turning nice and so maybe you can get in a hike, get enchanted rock, or you can enjoy some of the beautiful, natural beauty of Texas. - I am really, really excited about seeing the Hill Country. Going up into the High Plains, are the wineries as kind of clustered and close together, or are they more far flung? - They're a bit more far flung. There are a few in Lubbock proper, the town of Lubbock. And then A lot of the farmers that produce, you know, the larger vineyards in Texas will have a tasting room at the vineyard. So that's definitely something to see and can be fun as well. So you may be tasting in somebody's barn, for instance, which is really back to the dirt. Love it. Oh, that sounds like a blast. I definitely need to. I like a barn. I've actually done a podcast interview in a barn or two in my time. New goals, new goals. [Laughs] What about in terms of Austin, are there some things going on in Austin, whether in terms of wineries or just wine culture, wine bar, restaurants of note? I mean, I think of Austin, I've played music in Austin, so it does come to mind as there's probably some good food there. There is great food in Austin. And there are two tasting rooms of note that I would mention. Of course, the wineries with vineyards are a bit further outside of the town of Austin. But within the town of Austin, I want you to look for Wine for the People is the name of the brand. And they have a tasting room that they share with a cheese shop. And Ray and make some exceptionally good wines that you can taste there. And the other is called the Austin Winery. And not only is it a full production winery, they hire people who have their own wine projects. And so you may have five or six other winemakers working on their own labels within the Austin Winery building. And they do a ton of fun events. And It's a very cool, vibey place. That sounds like a blast. What do you think are the opportunities and challenges that you see in Texas wine in general? One thing that's on my mind lately is that Texas restaurants have not done a great job at putting Texas wines on the wine list. There are exceptions, of course, and one of the exceptions is worth noting since you're going to Fredericksburg. It's a restaurant called the Cabernet grill, and they have a 100 % Texas wine list. And they have a huge wine list and excellent food. So check that out. But in general, there are a lot of these farm to table restaurants that are really into local everything except for the wine list. And I find that unfortunate. So that is a huge opportunity. I think we do need more, more vineyards being planted faster than they currently are because there are so many new wineries opening every day and we just can't Do it with the amount of grapes. I mean this year. We've had a tremendous harvest And so this year I don't anticipate a shortage of Texas grapes, but some years when there is a bad freeze or hail There might be a problem for some wineries getting all the fruit that they want Do you see versus the high plains and the hill country, do you see a lot more growers in the high plains also making their own wine? And then in the hill country, more people buying grapes and making wine or is there generally a pretty large culture of buying grapes from a grower in Texas overall? In the Hill Country, almost every winery, even if they have an estate vineyard, they also purchase grapes from elsewhere in Texas. And I should say that there are actually vineyards that aren't even in an AVA that are just in some county that may have a county designation on the label. So not everything is there. But in the high plains, you have larger vineyards, and it is true that many of those also have their own label. So they're selling maybe 80 % of their grapes, they're 90, and just keeping a small bit to make wine for their own label. - Are there other areas outside of those two AVAs that we've really talked about that even if it's tiny, might be interesting to know about? - Yes, definitely. Well, one is the Texoma region, which is the closest to me. I'm in Dallas, and along the border with Oklahoma is a region called Texoma, and it is... That's adorable, by the way. Texoma. I know. It's a lively little community of farmers and winemakers, and they're putting out some great wines as well. Now, once again, they also bring in fruit from across the state, but there are vineyards in that area too. Another region we're talking about that's not an AVA, but is the Texas Gulf Coast. And that is, as it sounds, along the coast, but it's very humid there. So they are not necessarily growing vitisfinifera. They're growing hybrids. And there are two hybrids that are particularly well known in Texas that you may come across. One is called l 'anoir, or another name for it is black Spanish. And that's a red grape. And then the other is called called Blanc Dubois and it's a white grape. Both of them are very versatile. You can have them dry, you can have them sweet, you can have them fortified. So you'll see those both pop up in a number of different ways across Texas. And then there's an area that's actually the highest elevation in all of Texas out in an AVA called Texas Davis Mountains. It's the highest elevation vineyard in the state at 5 ,600 feet of elevation and on volcanic soil. So really unique. And it's an area that people are certainly interested in. There are more vineyards going in out there, although it is quite remote. It is five hours from the Fredericksburg area and in a different direction than Lubbock. So it's really out there. There's not a lot of agriculture, but I'm very excited about the quality of the fruit that that region will produce. That sounds so interesting. It sounds like there's really a great, great variety. Yeah, for sure. There's just, there's a lot going on. I mean, I love that there's enough Texas wine for you to have your work cut out for you doing a podcast covering it all. That's, I mean, that's just in and of itself made me realize that there was something to see here. For sure. Yeah, I don't think I'm going to run out of material anytime anytime soon. One thing I heard you talk about a little bit on your podcast is the TechSOM conference. I had just associated that with some like Sommelier thing, but it sounds like there might be more to it than that. Yes. So TechSOM is a couple of different things. One part of it is a wine competition that happens in the spring. And so wineries from all around the world submit wines to be judged as part of the competition. And within that, there's a sommelier retreat. So people from around the US generally come and learn about wine. If they're studying for a test, they may get coaching around blind tasting and things like that. The other part of Tex -Som is a beverage conference and that just happened in August. Once again, people from around the world come in and it's a two and a half three day conference on all kinds of topics. I mean, just this year I went to a talk about all hybrids and we did a tasting of 12 different hybrids with instructors who are top, top, top in their field. So many of them are masters of wine, master sommeliers, or people who've written books on these topics. And it's just several days of tasting through exhibitions where different wineries or regions may set up tables. It's a professional tasting atmosphere, but also very intense seminars on cool topics of all sorts. So I couldn't recommend it highly enough. It sounds really fun. Shelly, can you do some a little bit of defining for us in terms of the difference between vidus finifera and a hybrid wine grape? Vidus finifera is the grapevine responsible for most of the most common grapevines in the world that make quality wine. So the parents of a hybrid grape are the combination of the vidus finifera species and then other species of grapes from North America. - Exactly. And they can handle often temperatures that Vitus minifera can't handle. They are perhaps more tolerant of diseases or irrigation issues. They're just a little more hearty. Some people don't consider them quite as high quality as others, but I think they can be made in ways that are high quality and quite tasty. I'm really interested to see that that's a conference topic because, you know, the American grape varieties and the hybrids of the American and European varieties in the past had been considered really inferior to the European grape species, vitus finifera. But now that there's so much going on with climate change, there's a lot of attention going to them and some of the farmers that I've talked to who have to grow hybrids because they're in a really cold area, like really far in the northeast or something have told me that it's not that they're bad grapes, they just need different attention and to have a focus on them and to really get to know them. And there are actually still even today new hybrids coming onto the market, and Texas has some of the most recent ones that have been developed at UC Davis by Dr. Andy Walker, and they're called Walker Varieties. And so they are coming into Texas slowly, but surely more in, you know, test vineyards just to kind of, we're going to play around with these. And they all have, they've all been kind of bred to do something different. It seems like there's a lot of experimentation experimentation going on in Texas? - Absolutely. - Do you see that as something that will help winemakers just in Texas or something that people might be able to study or look at from around the world and get some inspiration from what people are finding out there? - I think that there is opportunity for other regions in the world to learn from Texas. Just in the past few years, I've noticed more and more international attention on international visitors coming to Texas, both professional visitors and general tourists. Texas has joined the OIV, an international wine association. And I think that we're the only state in the United States that's a member. And so there have been these international contingents of folks coming in who are very interested in and what's going on in Texas. So it's fun to see. I've got a little bit of a funny story to tell you that I think you'll like. I was in Umbria at a wonderful leather worker's shop. The leather worker was actually from Tuscany. In fact, I'm showing off here my Italian purse. Wow. This is like little backpack purse. I got it a long time ago and it's just in perfect shape. Anyway, wonderful, talented person. And he made these belt buckles, these very Americana inspired belt buckles that like said Texas on them and had stars and stuff. But they were so small. They were just, you know, the size at the width of your belt, they weren't any bigger than that. So tell us why that's funny. Well, everything's bigger in Texas. And so obviously in Texas belt buckles are generally quite large and flashy. You may find this humorous. One of the biggest wine competitions in America, actually, is associated with a Houston livestock show and rodeo. And if you win, you get a saddle, a horse saddle. If you win pop winery, you get an actual saddle. And there's a winery in the health country. You may want to stop by. They have, I think, four or five saddles displayed in their tasting room. But if you win kind of a class championship, so your wine is the best, you know, San Jose, say $25 to $40, you get a belt buckle. So people collect, I mean, they have a million belt buckles. And if you're lucky, maybe even a saddle. Wow. I love that. That is some local culture people. That is wonderful. If I had a belt buckle, I'm not sure what I would do with it to be frank, but I'm a city girl. It's true. Do you ride horses, Shelly? No, I've been on a horse a few times in my life, but no, I live in the middle of Dallas, so I'm definitely not a regular horse rider, although they're beautiful creatures. There is a great variety of variety of Texan experiences clearly. Not everyone's running around with a, what do they call it, a 10 gallon hat? Yes, I believe they do. You know, listen, if anybody wants to, if a belt buckle comes my way, I think I'll figure out how to rock it. I grew up in a small town in western Nebraska myself, and I think I'm going to be riding some horses on this trip, it looks like, and I haven't been on a horse in a little longer than I want to say. So we'll see how that goes. Oh, I hope there's some great video footage from this. As I think Texans would say, we're fixing to capture that. Indeed. Some Texans say that. Some Texans say that. Now, a variety of Texas accents. Do you want to speak to that at all? I mean, sometimes I'll-- I think-- I don't know if you get this when you're outside of Texas, But I think people expect a really strong accent, but that's not the case from everybody. I mean, obviously people have all kinds of accents no matter where they're from. But can you tell where somebody's from in Texas when they show up on your door? - No, not at all. I think that most common delineation is an urban versus rural accent. My husband is from a very small town, and he is a little twangy, I must admit. But he really turns it on when he's been visiting with his parents. So if he's in his normal Dallas setting, I don't hear it as much. But when he goes back home to Henrietta, Texas, population 2600, he does sound a little bit Western, I have to admit. But yeah, that's probably the biggest thing is urban versus rural. But so many people are moving to Texas from all over. So even within Dallas, I mean, 80 % of the people I probably see on a given day are not from Texas. - Right, I love the twang. I think it's gorgeous. I'm excited to go and immerse myself in all the different types of language from wherever they're derived out there in Texas. And I'm really looking forward to it. I'm curious, what are some Texas wines that, just specific bottles that have come across your palette lately that really excited you. Oh, well, I have a soft spot for bubbles, bubbles of all sorts. And a couple that I turned to year after year are, I guess I would say there's a wide variety, right? So one of them is from Old Vine, Chenin Blanc from Texas up in the high plains, which is just beautiful. And that one in particular is from a brand called La Valentia, and I mentioned Wine for the People in Austin, and that's a project of Ray Wilson. And so I love the sparkling Chenin Blanc. On the other hand, a bright, fun, bubbly, pink sparkling wine that I love is from Tenote, and it's called the Bending Branch Frazonte Tenote. So good Frazonte, like the Italians, right? But that's another one that I would try to look for. Bending Branch is a little winery in Comfort, Texas, which is not too far from Fredericksburg. And they have their specialists in Tenote. Comfort, Texas, that sounds like a setting for a novel. And that wine sounds very comforting. And Tenote is lovely. I wanted to ask you, Have you always been a writer? Tell me about the convergence of your writing life and your wine life. You ended up writing for a wine magazine, but were you a writer who became a wine fan? What's the timeline there? Well, I'm a person who went to business school and did a little bit of writing, but more consulting and a little bit of strategy development and kind of problem solving corporations, particularly in the health care industry and in the nonprofit space. So I've done a lot of different things. I've always enjoyed writing, but I can't say that I, it was a focus of my career and I also didn't write for pleasure. So I just wasn't doing it, but it felt really good to stretch, stretch myself in that way. And when I started learning about wine, I thought, um, I want to do this in a different kind of way. I don't want to necessarily take the common road and go to work for a distributor or go to work for a winery. I thought I kind of want to chart my own course here. And so that's how it came about. I've enjoyed the writing, but sometimes I also enjoy just talking face to face with people about wine. And that's something that you don't always get with the writing. And so it's just, I like doing a little bit of a lot of different things, which is how I ended up as a consultant because you definitely do that as a consultant, a lot of variety. Yeah, I guess I'm seeing your podcast as kind of a writerly podcast, even though it's largely interview -based because of the research you do and kind of how fun it is. You got a lot of different stuff on your website. Do you want to tell us about your website? What's your website called? I keep talking about how great it is. Yeah, the website's called ThisIsTexasWine .com And you can see a page for every episode that I've put out and then also some resources. So who are the key players in the state that are focused on Texas wine growing, Texas viticulture, et cetera. There's kind of a lot there. There's some maps, as you mentioned, and some other podcasts that I think are fun references. So if you can't find it, if you have a question, you can email me. There's contact information on the, on the podcast as well. Fantastic. Well, Shelly, it's been a real pleasure talking with you today. Well, this has been fun. Thanks so much for having me. I'm delighted to have you experience Texas Wine and Hospitality in the very near future. Thank you so much, Shelly. Thanks for all your work that you do. Absolutely. You too. I'm excited to continue my exploration of everything you've got up. I feel like if I had one last question for you, it would just be if you met somebody who just said, "Texas wine," and they hadn't heard about it at all. You sort of had one little takeaway, one thing to say. What would you tell them? I'd say, "Let's sit down and do a tasting. That's the best way to learn about a place is let's open some bottles and talk about it. - Great advice. I totally agree. Thank you for listening to "Moto de Berre," wherever you go and whatever you like to drink, always remember to enjoy your life and to never stop learning. - I love it. And I'll just end by the way I end my podcast and say, cheers, y 'all. - Follow "Moto de Berre" on YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok for even more unique and unique and encouraging drinks and language content. If you would love for the show to continue and grow, support Motodiberi on Patreon and unlock bonus episodes. Find out more at motodiberi .com, or you can also sign up for my newsletter. Music for the podcast was composed by Ursilia Prosperi and performed by the band O. You can purchase their recordings at oumusic .bandcamp .com. (singing in foreign language) ¿El brazo vayas o que permanecen dejándose llevar? ¿Un otro se engañando? ¿Se dejan separarse mismo?